I agree that there is no accountability. I recently posted an article and all the responses were from "not verified" and mostly attacking each others comments including a very long piece that appears as a comment on a number of other articles. I hope that NP powers really look at this issue and come up with something soon because at this rate it will turn this site into a slanderous mess. I know that the owners and staff have worked long and hard to make this site special where others have failed. I hope they stay on top of it and also hope others will comment on this situation. Happy New Year 2009

Have to say that this discussion, in much the same way as others raised by contributors here,  has already appeared in the Black Hole that is the Forum.

http://my.nowpublic.com/newsroom/forum/anonymous-comments

And in much a similar way to concerns over some other issues, there has been little or minimal progress.

As far as Anons go - sure it sparked off something of a debate at the time, but apart from Anons now being requested to provide an email address (in itself not verified - and to prove my point I'm trying to leave this comment logged on as an Anon and giving a non-existent email address as far as I know) before leaving a comment, things have very much stayed as they were.

Actually many issues raised by members seem to be somewhat cyclical. The nature of the site means that new members arrive and soon learn some of the drawbacks (as well as advantages), and eventually often start voicing the very same concerns raised by established members that seem to have popped up time after time.

If you have a moment, take a look back at previous forum posts on points and the ranking system, copying and pasting, highlighting without intros, flaming, code of conduct violations, integrity and so on and so forth.

You'll see the same sort of gripes, moans, queries and suggestions from contributors, some of whom seem to have stopped posting altogether.

And that in itself also seems to be a feature of NP. As fast as new members arrive, established ones - for whatever reason - just appear to stop contributing.

Right now technical problems seem to be the order of the day especially the new story creation process, with yet again some established members threatening to give up and leave for good, or post far less

As far as Anons go (and that after all was the issue you raised, so I'll try to stop my keyboard trots running riot) - they seem to be here to stay.

If you don't like what they're saying, think the comments are racist, personal, sexist, insulting or whatever - ignore them. Don't encourage them by responding (easier said than done perhaps).

If you feel that the Anonymous comment has overstepped the mark, get in touch with one of the permanent editors, explain and ask them to zap it. They're paid to make those decisions and will do so if they deem it necessary.

If another member starts attacking or insulting you - send them a private message and/or again get in touch with one of the permanent editors.

And if all else fails - just turn away from the screen for a while, go outside and find somewhere to have a jolly good scream à la Sally Bowles in Cabaret, talk to someone around you who might remind you that the virtual world in which we all "operate" here is not in fact reality in itself (that has always helped me when I've seriously wanted to brain someone the other end of the screen) or find whatever solution works best for you.

Happy New Year.

Johnny Summerton

Johnny, yes, I started the forum post you pointed out there. Nothing came of it, you're right. That's why I encouraged tikun to make another post to see if it makes any difference.

I, too, cynically notice that the same questions are asked over and over again here in NP, and nothing is ever really addressed or changed. It sometimes makes me want to stop trying at all.

And that in itself also seems to be a feature of NP. As fast as new members arrive, established ones - for whatever reason - just appear to stop contributing.

This, I feel, is the saddest part of what you wrote. And so true. We've lost many good members here at NP because of these gripes.

Alice

I realize that the same problems seem to be addressed at NowPublic; mostly I think that is because there are only a few problems that cause some friction between members, however I always try to address issues in the forum, and if there is something you think I may have missed please feel free to bring it to my attention.

As for the anon comments, I realize that sometimes there are anon comments that are useless, annoying, racist and just plain mean, but I think some of us would agree that there are also some very useful anon comments. Sometimes we get comments on stories that are really relevant and important, but these people don't want to sign up for an account just to make one comment, so anon commenting is the way for them to do this. It's just like some blogs and even other news sites.

The downside to anon commenting is of course, that people can hide behind it and feel that they can say what they want because no one will know who they are. However, know that anon commentors have no rights on NP. I will delete any comment instantly that I feel violates our Code of Conduct in any way and unless an anon comment is useful and constructive, I rarely respond to any.

There are two sides to this issue, and both have valid points. Know that we know how some of our long standing members feel about anon commenting however; we are not ignoring you.

In the meantime, please feel free to send me a message any time you see an anon comment that violates our Code of Conduct, or that you would like me to take a look at.

Amy, thank you for this response. Yes, you're right, you do address the issues which are raised - it was wrong of me to say that they're not addressed. My apologies for that.

I think the issues on NP come largely from members working very hard to keep the site working to a high standard, and their frustrations at inflammatory comments, cut and pastes, point-grabbing etc. But thank you for your work here.

Re. anon comments: I wonder if it would be possible for members to have more control over their own columns. I myself get very annoyed when I see an inflammatory anon comment on my column that I can do nothing about (without the help of staff who can't be expected to be on the case within seconds). I know that giving members the ability to remove comments from their own columns brings with it its own problems, but I am hoping that we could reach a compromise. For example, could such comments be hidden by members until they are reviewed by staff who could then restore them/ delete them permanently as appropriate?

It might be an idea to gather suggestions like this to see if we can reach a solution. (I can't remember if we did that before or not.)

(Edited for typo.)

Yes I know we have many members who work hard on a daily basis to uphold an NP standard, and I try to let them know personally how grateful we all are for that, although if I have missed anyone, sorry!

I don't know much about the mechanics of allowing members to have any control over their own posts, but like you said, that does raise its own concerns.

We are always open to suggestions however on how to improve the site. We do actually want to make it better and easier to use, we promise!

Great post. Thanks so much for the heads-up and timely advise. Deep breath and keep living in the "real" world that is.

Steve

Maybe the "ANON" problem could be solved if the Authors of the Post had some sort of power to remove them them self since as Amy stated they do have no rights on NP.

I do agree with Amy here that the Anon do contribute some rather good comments as well, however those that stand out and can really get under once skin are the bad once off course.

Now giving all Authors the power to be able to remove Anon comments does have a down side as well. They could remove comments that are good yet critical of the post and that would be counter productive.

I do not know the statistics here however I would presume that we may find more Positive then negative anon comments. Yet the debate is good and if some thing positive comes out of it even though it was addressed earlier one can not expect it to be resolved right away and this as I stated because their are several facets to conceder here.

Johnny does bring up a couple off good points and yes members have left NP for diverse reason and some of them are because of emotions running high at times and just quiet, after all it is not like once lively hood depends on it nor are we in line for the any sort of Nobel price or any other prestige. No it is our own time and nerves and could be perceived or seen as some sort of volunteering like the the Salvation Army only we do it with the news. Okay not quiet, but it is in the same direction as volunteering.

Yes we lost some very good people and some of them I do miss, they where good writers and actually broth great post out better then most here. Yet I do recall rather well why they left and the circumstances as well. It was not NP, no it was they own ego and some sort of a fight with another member or felling unfairly treated even though that was not the case yet so they felt, or because some thing they read in the press about NP really upset them and they just left..... I could go into details here. All Members I liked, respected and that like most of us care about their work and NP as well as their fellow CJ or Contributors.  

Some of those we lost where great people and Great writers and the longer we remain the more we will notice this as well as miss some of them. However that is the case with any business and village or Family People come and go and yes it is sad in some cases and good in others. The amazing thing though here on NP is that we are free to discuss it now in the Forum wish was not always the case as I remember rather well.

We are fee to discuss, debate and criticize NP and be criticized as well, I saw a couple of NP forum Post Criticizing me as well, and that is fair. 

I do not think that I am defending NP nor attacking it here. Nor am I defending or attacking any one in this Forum or any member per say. However I am trying to see things the way they really are and why and how we could solve this or find solutions to it. In this particular Forum Issue broth up by tikun here, The solution is difficult to find since no matter how we may approach this we will have an equal number of pro and cons to deal with. I suppose the Super Editors and Owners will have another debate on the issue and make yet another decision on it as well.

Yet the debate is good and the fact that we can have this debate is grand!

I like the 'thumbs up-thumbs down' way of voting on comments.

I suspect that is another system that would be abused, Rene. Comments would be voted down for personal reasons etc.

If some one would just spend a few minutes and check out the not verified comments you will clearly see that for every solid one there are tens of comments that not only violate the code of conduct but are mean, cruel, abusive and downright ugly. Not a good situation. At least the person that has some kind of a persona has pierced the veil of anonymity. There is a community awareness and cultural pressure to behave accordingly.  There is absolutely none for the not verified.

Understanding crowd powered News. Readers are more interested in the comment section (to see themselves here) than in the article. I agree hard to understand for the Writers. Big Newspapers went through this experience. The moment they delay the comments by control readers stay away go other "Push button publish" newsblogs. Especially I am wondering if the paid opinion writers are so , hm, free radicals, can not stay other opinions. On an american style Newspaper site this is normal. anyway we have not enough young readers who speak a complete different language.

What do you suggest about the abuse factor? If left unchecked what does that do to the standards of NP.? Does it really matter. Am I making something out of nothing? Am I caring too much about this kind of situation and should  I retire quietly into my virtual bed?

Hey, solar, this is NOT a US site.

I just write because I like to write about interesting events and give my Op/Ed, if someone takes a contrary opinion, that's okay as well. If someone is abusive, well I prefer to keep it posted so others can see what a Turd Bandit they are.  HA!  Anyhoo, got a new spankin computer today, so we shall see this weekend if NP software is going to be giving me a headache, if not I will continue posting, if it is same sh*t different diaper, then Ghandi is my Nameo.  Hopefully all will work, and Jordan can take a well deserved rest finding patches for my computer.

Happy Belated New Year all. See ya'll this weekend!

Cool. Enjoy the spanking new machine. I enjoy it more then a new car. As they say in this part of the country. Mazel Tov ( good luck )

Thanks Tikun

I couldn't agree more with the general content of this topic article.

I've only been here a very short while so I do not want to appear as a know-all, god forbid, but it is incontestable that the proportion of abusive etc comment by non verified people is far above that to be seen on the site in general. I left the site I contributed to before precisely because of the amount of uncensored personal and racial abuse on it and, depending on the subject, on my own posts too. 

My humble take? Any contributor should be given the permanent option of deleting abusive comments, on his/her own posts only, from any NV commenter, from the moment that site moderators see that he/she is not likely to abuse the privilege and from the moment the contributor asks for the option to be activated, citing a first particular example  . I don't see why people should be forced to avoid posts because they are offended by the insulting anonymous content of the comments on it.......

Hello, respects, and thanks to all,

Fripouille.

Today was perhaps not a good example of anon commenting, but we do usually get a lot more beneficial comments that are anonymous than we do get inappropriate and hateful ones. It is especially useful on stories where people who live in the area can comment without having to sign up first.

We can't give each user the ability to delete comments on their own post as the technology just does not exist for it, but we have looked into that already as we thought of it as an option as well.

Anyone can always send myself or another staff member a message if they see an anonymous comment that they feel breaks our Code of Conduct and we can remove it.

Also, know that an anon commentor has no rights on NP - their comments can be edited, deleted, removed and they can be blocked without having to be notified - one of the many benefits to having an NP account.

Anyway, people who post hateful things under an anon comment usually have a reason to hide and can't handle the backlash they might get if they actually had an NP account, I think.